The original and still the best Blog for Birders across South Wales
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Field craft Badger! i was in a hide at dark and what you see are the Owls moving around on their own free will,unlike some people who just follow them around in the hope of getting something.
mitch i ain't having a go at you personally, i'm not happy about the sudden trend in experienced birders with camera's trying to get the perfect shot of a rare bird like the seo.Dont get me wrong i'm the first one to give good comments on a brilliant image of birds like the one steve hinton has taken, and no doubt steve and yourself probably have put the time effort and field craft into getting such images. But my problem is more and more birders are buying big lens camera's resulting in more and more people trying to get the perfect photo leading to more and more disturbance. So there comes a time when someone has got to speak up and say enough is enough
Enough of what Badger? enough of people taking photo's?,because from what I have seen it is birders and dog walkers, not togger's constantly pushing these birds up.It seems all to easy to portion blame on the photographers because they have a close up when in fact it is others causing the majority of disturbance.Don't forget that in order to get a close up you can't just march in there (do that and all you will get is dots!),no, most of those who persevere use fieldcraft,possibly a hide or other concealment,thereby reducing disturbance and getting a natural looking shot,on the other hand how many birders and dog walkers use such craft....errr not many.
I hear what you're saying Badger but while there are Birders/Photographers investing in huge money on their gear it's something that's not going to go away too soon and when a golden opportunity comes along like this one they're going to take full advantage of the situation,it's been about 25yrs since we had an influx of S E Owls around Cardiff.The now famous site at Aust warth has been going on for years and that hasn't bothered the owls at all,all we can do is name and shame the Idiots that push the birds too far.
Mitch you hit the nail on the head there money,opportunity and 25yrs, just because you spend big money on equipment that doesn't give you the right to keep turning up day after day disturbing owls whilst they are roosting during the day.I'll use steve as an example you talk about opportunity, steve took his opportunity and delivered images that couldn't get any closer yet he still goes down to try and get more,and you say that it's been 25yrs since you've had SEO like this down the wharf, well i can tell you, if you keep this up it will be another 25yrs until you see these birds again. Slaphead yes i'll had enough of people taking photo's dont get me wrong there's nothing wrong with a couple of photo's it's just that more and more birders are turning to photography all trying to get the perfect image 2yrs ago there were 2 or 3 now there are probably 6 or 7 before long there will be 12 or 13 birders with camera's all wanting the perfect image, all i'm saying is these birds need a little peace is that too much to ask?
How best to go about getting pictures without disturbing the owls, then? (I'm another of those dreadful photographers planning on coming over soon hoping to get a few shots.)
Jeremy ever heard of waiting for them to come out from their roost? If you want to take photo's of these birds i suggest you go down just before dusk and not in the middle of the afternoon
Badger, all of the 'toggers I have spoken to all wait for them to come out of the roost (I would stand corrected though),the digital age has given rise to lots of birders with cameras,most of whom act sensibly,some individuals (Dartford-gate springs to mind) do not behave sensibly. I think you are banging on the wrong door though in blaming all 'toggers for flushing these birds.
Badger,what you see there is the result of ONE!! early morning session,9 photos don't represent 9 visits,i'm usually down there in the afternoon. Guess where i'll be tomorrow afters?
Paul-we all share your sentiments and nobody deplores disturbance more than the "toggers" amongst us. I have an interest in photography that dates back to the early '80s and in fact still have a top end 35mm Canon SLR and a couple of good lenses in the back of a cupboard somewhere. I became a birder (I use the term loosely !) who in the last two years has invested in some good digital kit and now combine both hobbies. This and other blogs would soon become very boring if were not for the likes of myself,Steve,Mitch,Smudger,Tiger,Slaphead,Pedro and Alex posting images. Cast your mind back earlier this year to May when you and me were checking your many nestboxes near Mynydd ty Talwyn,Maesteg,if I hadn't had my camera and long lens in my hand at the time we would not now jointly hold a record for a county first of Black Stork in Glamorgan. The record would have just been of a crane/stork sp. We "toggers" do have our uses !! I have visited RGW twice in the last 3 weeks and by using fieldcraft and with a little luck have come away with some images that I have been very pleased with. I have also witnessed some terrible behaviour by some other so called photographers (I use that term extremely loosely)who chased owls from one end of the wharf to the other,when I questionned them about the total absence of fieldcraft they didn't seem to know what I was talking about. In all fairness the "toggers" who post on this blog have the welfare of the birds more at heart than most of the birders who are visiting. The quality of the images captured by some of us could not have been achieved with good use of fieldcraft.
bloody computer this is the third time i've written this now so i'll keep it short. Mitch point taken but judging by the light on the photo's i'd say more than 1 visit was made but i'm not hear to argue, Jeff mentioned 8 birders that are into photography just on this blog that makes 8 visits just from this blog and i take it they've made more than 1 visit anyway Jeff you missing my point mate i've got no problem what so ever with people taken photos of the SEO or any other birds. Its the constant re-visiting and the amount of people going down the wharf during roosting hrs disturbing the birds just for a photo, i think it's absolutely criminal, but thats just my opinion all i want is for people to put the welfare of the birds first. But by the sounds of it, it's falling on deaf ears so i dont want to keep on about it, just wish you could all see where i'm coming from, put it this way it makes you think twice about announcing any rare birds in the area if birder's are only thinking about a photo before the welfare of the birds
It's not just your computer that's playing up it's your mind as well.Did you know that when you turn around to face in another direction the angle of light also changes! JEEZE!! I can assure you they were all taken on the one visit,if your over the wharf tomorrow afternoon i'll show you the proof.
Mitch i wouldn't know mate but i'll take your word for it, as for my mind your right i do question my sanity when i come on here and see all these owl photo's and think to myself am i seeing things. I think i will come down the wharf the weekend and i'll fetch my camera, but i want be taken photo's of owls, i'll be taken photo's of the idiots that are flushing the birds and naming and shaming them. So anyone thinking of trampling across the roosting area be warned.
Only 3 per post? I might need to make a few post then, you'll probably get bored looking at all my naming and shaming photos.Misty you right i'm afraid,i will be careful who i tell about any goodies up this way mate i might just keep em to myself.
Badger,in all seriousness, I think your sentiments are echoed by a lot of us. The long lens brigade are literally scum. Nothing more or less. Bird murdering bastards. It's a little know fact that more birds are killed every year by photographers than cats, the maltese and the americans combined. Fact. If I factored (again, please note the use of the word FACT - therefore it must be true)in the Cypriots you'd be thinking I was taking the piss. Which clearly I'm not. I was going to mention the French love of drowning passerines in brandy, but that would have been pushing it further still. Then of course there's the greed of mankind and issues regarding loss of habitat, pollution and illegal persecution to consider (ever thought of taking your protest to a grouse moor?). Anyway, I digress, those scum bag photographers (I'm back on track now), are literally the spawn of the antichrist. I suggest we simply take the lot of them, drown them in the finest cognac (it's like Brains SA, only a bit different), roast the fuckers on a BBQ and sell them for dog food. The worst of them is called Cliff. He's rubbish at buying coffee but great at stealing olives off you. I suggest we start by killing Cliff? Hinton next, then Jeff. We'll leave Smudger till last because he still needs a decent shot of the owls. What do you reckon? Going too far or is the irony lost on you? I'd take my strife to a grouse moor if I was you.
PS It's exactly seven years since I last worked on a grouse moor during a vole year. That was a bumper year for SEOs too.....looks like the vole cycle has been good again this year? I'm not a serious enough birder to know the significance of such things. Perhaps if 'serious' birders in the county actually contacted other recorders around the country/ abroad, you might actually find out where these birds have come from. Good vole years don't neccesarily happen across a whole region/ country, so..... just a thought! PS SEO hunt mostly during the day (hence the yellow eyes). Orange eyes denote an owl species that hunts more in the crepuscular hours (dawn and dusk)....dark eyes are associated with nocturnal species. Think about some of the comments that have been made about these birds and disturbance/ roosting?
HERE IS A STATEMENT FROM THE RSPB WEBSITE TAKE A NOTE OF THE LAST SENTENCE
Short-eared owls are medium sized owls with mottled brown bodies, pale under-wings and yellow eyes. They are commonly seen hunting during the day. In winter, there is an influx of continental birds (from Scandinavia, Russia, Iceland) to northern, eastern, and parts of central southern England, especially around the coast. They are of European conservation concern and so are an Amber List species.
Where to see them
In the UK they breed primarily in Northern England and Scotland, but are seen more widely in winter. Short-eared owls are best looked for in winter on coastal marshes and wetlands. However, birdwatchers must be careful to avoid disturbance at communal roost sites.
Thanks Badger. The RSPB believe so much in Wales that they have have the sum total of 12 reserves in Wales (out of a total of 200 nationally). Great to know they care so much about SEOs.....but not so much in Wales....why is that? Now that is an interesting debate! Again Badger, I love your sentiment (Mitch is another bastard that joins the list of people we need to 'bump off'), but surely there are bigger fish to fry than a bunch of idiots on this blog?????
I blame the Government - well the last one that sold out the Severn Bridge to the French - if the toll wasn't so expensive we could all go over to Aust every day and flush - I mean photograph - their English Owls instead. As someone who has yet to take a decent pic of the SEOs - because I care too much/ I'm too lazy - I have to say that actual disturbance on my visits has been limited to just a couple of pushers who frankly have no idea of how to behave - just walking up to a roosting Owl - the rest on this thread do not condone their actions and do not act in the same way and leave the owls to rest - some here by using bag hides can get nearer and back away without the owls taking notice. Thats Fieldcraft - TURN green now!
32 comments:
Congrats Rob,brilliant shots,your perseverance has paid off big time,nice one !!
Cheers! Jeff. Flight shots are difficult though,i got a few but nothing good enough to put on here.
only a few? The amount of times them birds have been put up by birders you should have stacks of flight shots.
Field craft Badger! i was in a hide at dark and what you see are the Owls moving around on their own free will,unlike some people who just follow them around in the hope of getting something.
mitch i ain't having a go at you personally, i'm not happy about the sudden trend in experienced birders with camera's trying to get the perfect shot of a rare bird like the seo.Dont get me wrong i'm the first one to give good comments on a brilliant image of birds like the one steve hinton has taken, and no doubt steve and yourself probably have put the time effort and field craft into getting such images. But my problem is more and more birders are buying big lens camera's resulting in more and more people trying to get the perfect photo leading to more and more disturbance. So there comes a time when someone has got to speak up and say enough is enough
Enough of what Badger? enough of people taking photo's?,because from what I have seen it is birders and dog walkers, not togger's constantly pushing these birds up.It seems all to easy to portion blame on the photographers because they have a close up when in fact it is others causing the majority of disturbance.Don't forget that in order to get a close up you can't just march in there (do that and all you will get is dots!),no, most of those who persevere use fieldcraft,possibly a hide or other concealment,thereby reducing disturbance and getting a natural looking shot,on the other hand how many birders and dog walkers use such craft....errr not many.
I hear what you're saying Badger but while there are Birders/Photographers investing in huge money on their gear it's something that's not going to go away too soon and when a golden opportunity comes along like this one they're going to take full advantage of the situation,it's been about 25yrs since we had an influx of S E Owls around Cardiff.The now famous site at Aust warth has been going on for years and that hasn't bothered the owls at all,all we can do is name and shame the Idiots that push the birds too far.
At one time or another I guess you put all your names in that category then
Mitch you hit the nail on the head there money,opportunity and 25yrs, just because you spend big money on equipment that doesn't give you the right to keep turning up day after day disturbing owls whilst they are roosting during the day.I'll use steve as an example you talk about opportunity, steve took his opportunity and delivered images that couldn't get any closer yet he still goes down to try and get more,and you say that it's been 25yrs since you've had SEO like this down the wharf, well i can tell you, if you keep this up it will be another 25yrs until you see these birds again. Slaphead yes i'll had enough of people taking photo's dont get me wrong there's nothing wrong with a couple of photo's it's just that more and more birders are turning to photography all trying to get the perfect image 2yrs ago there were 2 or 3 now there are probably 6 or 7 before long there will be 12 or 13 birders with camera's all wanting the perfect image, all i'm saying is these birds need a little peace is that too much to ask?
How best to go about getting pictures without disturbing the owls, then? (I'm another of those dreadful photographers planning on coming over soon hoping to get a few shots.)
Jeremy ever heard of waiting for them to come out from their roost? If you want to take photo's of these birds i suggest you go down just before dusk and not in the middle of the afternoon
Badger, all of the 'toggers I have spoken to all wait for them to come out of the roost (I would stand corrected though),the digital age has given rise to lots of birders with cameras,most of whom act sensibly,some individuals (Dartford-gate springs to mind) do not behave sensibly. I think you are banging on the wrong door though in blaming all 'toggers for flushing these birds.
Badger,what you see there is the result of ONE!! early morning session,9 photos don't represent 9 visits,i'm usually down there in the afternoon. Guess where i'll be tomorrow afters?
Paul-we all share your sentiments and nobody deplores disturbance more than the "toggers" amongst us.
I have an interest in photography that dates back to the early '80s and in fact still have a top end 35mm Canon SLR and a couple of good lenses in the back of a cupboard somewhere.
I became a birder (I use the term loosely !) who in the last two years has invested in some good digital kit and now combine both hobbies.
This and other blogs would soon become very boring if were not for the likes of myself,Steve,Mitch,Smudger,Tiger,Slaphead,Pedro and Alex posting images.
Cast your mind back earlier this year to May when you and me were checking your many nestboxes near Mynydd ty Talwyn,Maesteg,if I hadn't had my camera and long lens in my hand at the time we would not now jointly hold a record for a county first of Black Stork in Glamorgan.
The record would have just been of a crane/stork sp.
We "toggers" do have our uses !!
I have visited RGW twice in the last 3 weeks and by using fieldcraft and with a little luck have come away with some images that I have been very pleased with.
I have also witnessed some terrible behaviour by some other so called photographers (I use that term extremely loosely)who chased owls from one end of the wharf to the other,when I questionned them about the total absence of fieldcraft they didn't seem to know what I was talking about.
In all fairness the "toggers" who post on this blog have the welfare of the birds more at heart than most of the birders who are visiting.
The quality of the images captured by some of us could not have been achieved with good use of fieldcraft.
bloody computer this is the third time i've written this now so i'll keep it short. Mitch point taken but judging by the light on the photo's i'd say more than 1 visit was made but i'm not hear to argue, Jeff mentioned 8 birders that are into photography just on this blog that makes 8 visits just from this blog and i take it they've made more than 1 visit anyway Jeff you missing my point mate i've got no problem what so ever with people taken photos of the SEO or any other birds. Its the constant re-visiting and the amount of people going down the wharf during roosting hrs disturbing the birds just for a photo, i think it's absolutely criminal, but thats just my opinion all i want is for people to put the welfare of the birds first. But by the sounds of it, it's falling on deaf ears so i dont want to keep on about it, just wish you could all see where i'm coming from, put it this way it makes you think twice about announcing any rare birds in the area if birder's are only thinking about a photo before the welfare of the birds
It's not just your computer that's playing up it's your mind as well.Did you know that when you turn around to face in another direction the angle of light also changes! JEEZE!! I can assure you they were all taken on the one visit,if your over the wharf tomorrow afternoon i'll show you the proof.
And of course the sun will swing around in 4 or 5 hours.
Mitch i wouldn't know mate but i'll take your word for it, as for my mind your right i do question my sanity when i come on here and see all these owl photo's and think to myself am i seeing things. I think i will come down the wharf the weekend and i'll fetch my camera, but i want be taken photo's of owls, i'll be taken photo's of the idiots that are flushing the birds and naming and shaming them. So anyone thinking of trampling across the roosting area be warned.
Look forward to seeing the photos! Only 3 per post though!
Badger just stick to your guns and keep any rares to yourself, you wont be the only one
Only 3 per post? I might need to make a few post then, you'll probably get bored looking at all my naming and shaming photos.Misty you right i'm afraid,i will be careful who i tell about any goodies up this way mate i might just keep em to myself.
Badger,in all seriousness, I think your sentiments are echoed by a lot of us. The long lens brigade are literally scum. Nothing more or less. Bird murdering bastards. It's a little know fact that more birds are killed every year by photographers than cats, the maltese and the americans combined. Fact. If I factored (again, please note the use of the word FACT - therefore it must be true)in the Cypriots you'd be thinking I was taking the piss. Which clearly I'm not. I was going to mention the French love of drowning passerines in brandy, but that would have been pushing it further still. Then of course there's the greed of mankind and issues regarding loss of habitat, pollution and illegal persecution to consider (ever thought of taking your protest to a grouse moor?).
Anyway, I digress, those scum bag photographers (I'm back on track now), are literally the spawn of the antichrist. I suggest we simply take the lot of them, drown them in the finest cognac (it's like Brains SA, only a bit different), roast the fuckers on a BBQ and sell them for dog food. The worst of them is called Cliff. He's rubbish at buying coffee but great at stealing olives off you. I suggest we start by killing Cliff? Hinton next, then Jeff. We'll leave Smudger till last because he still needs a decent shot of the owls. What do you reckon? Going too far or is the irony lost on you?
I'd take my strife to a grouse moor if I was you.
PS It's exactly seven years since I last worked on a grouse moor during a vole year. That was a bumper year for SEOs too.....looks like the vole cycle has been good again this year? I'm not a serious enough birder to know the significance of such things. Perhaps if 'serious' birders in the county actually contacted other recorders around the country/ abroad, you might actually find out where these birds have come from. Good vole years don't neccesarily happen across a whole region/ country, so..... just a thought!
PS SEO hunt mostly during the day (hence the yellow eyes). Orange eyes denote an owl species that hunts more in the crepuscular hours (dawn and dusk)....dark eyes are associated with nocturnal species. Think about some of the comments that have been made about these birds and disturbance/ roosting?
Randal get to the point
:-) arguably the finest response to a piece of written drivel ever. Well done.
Hey! Randal what about me? surely i could do with a roasting then perhaps a good flogging!favoritism eh!
HERE IS A STATEMENT FROM THE RSPB WEBSITE TAKE A NOTE OF THE LAST SENTENCE
Short-eared owls are medium sized owls with mottled brown bodies, pale under-wings and yellow eyes. They are commonly seen hunting during the day. In winter, there is an influx of continental birds (from Scandinavia, Russia, Iceland) to northern, eastern, and parts of central southern England, especially around the coast. They are of European conservation concern and so are an Amber List species.
Where to see them
In the UK they breed primarily in Northern England and Scotland, but are seen more widely in winter. Short-eared owls are best looked for in winter on coastal marshes and wetlands. However, birdwatchers must be careful to avoid disturbance at communal roost sites.
Mitch, we better be careful!!!
Mums the word! shhhhh!
Thanks Badger. The RSPB believe so much in Wales that they have have the sum total of 12 reserves in Wales (out of a total of 200 nationally). Great to know they care so much about SEOs.....but not so much in Wales....why is that? Now that is an interesting debate! Again Badger, I love your sentiment (Mitch is another bastard that joins the list of people we need to 'bump off'), but surely there are bigger fish to fry than a bunch of idiots on this blog?????
That's better!
Randal i ain't out to fry mate, just trying to educate
I blame the Government - well the last one that sold out the Severn Bridge to the French - if the toll wasn't so expensive we could all go over to Aust every day and flush - I mean photograph - their English Owls instead.
As someone who has yet to take a decent pic of the SEOs - because I care too much/ I'm too lazy - I have to say that actual disturbance on my visits has been limited to just a couple of pushers who frankly have no idea of how to behave - just walking up to a roosting Owl - the rest on this thread do not condone their actions and do not act in the same way and leave the owls to rest - some here by using bag hides can get nearer and back away without the owls taking notice.
Thats Fieldcraft - TURN green now!
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